(President George W. Bush stands with Rep. Lindsey Graham (SC-R) on the steps of Air Force One at the Greenville/Spartanburg Airport 27 March 2002 in Greenville, South Carolina. (Photo by Tim Sloan, via Getty Images/AFP.)
Some members of the old guard are starting to issue statements on the recent events following the murder of George Floyd. President George W. Bush made a statement about Frederick Douglas, Harriet Tubman, Abraham Lincoln and Martin Luther King, Jr. being “heroes of unity.” Lindsey Graham (SC-R) has also just said he’s committed to a “deep dive” on policing and race relations that including building on Obama administration initiatives.
My first response was to become annoyed and incredulous, because I don’t typically believe a word either of these men say. Then I thought about how no other current members of the Republican Party are speaking out and some, like Senator Tom Cotton (AR-R,) are helping Trump to incite more violence.
Had these recent statements by Bush and Graham been made by someone else, someone who was not buried in their own life-long hypocrisy, I would think they were perfectly fine. My perception of them could be completely accurate or tainted, I honestly can’t decide.
My question to you is how do these statements, made by these men, make you feel? Are you insulted by them or do you think it’s better to learn eventually than to never learn at all? Are you someone who is more traditionally Conservative or Liberal and does this even matter? Have they learned or is this just more spin? What do you think?
As a moderate WOC, I think it's very Romneyesque of them, and am totally apathetic. It's like they're standing in front of a burning house whispering "fire."
I would like to believe that former president Bush was sincere, but not hanging hope on that peg. I don't believe a word from graham's mouth. He has strong opposition in November from a positive, strong, hopeful, young Black Democrat, who I pray will be victorious. graham is just trying to strengthen his reelection chances.
At least Dubya was never a Trump fan and, different than Bob Dole, for instance, he never made his peace with the Trump regime. So, I think his disgust with Trump is sincere. This is not his GOP. But he seems to be absolutely unaware how his own presidency laid the groundwork for the Trump presidency. His tax cuts, his budget cuts, his judges, his economic policy - it all hurt minorities. And then there was Katrina: a terrible display of neglect towards African Americans. I don't think that GWB is a racist, at least not overtly (even to himself). But he has to own his record before I would give him the benefit of the doubt.
I think President Bush is sincere, however Lindsey Graham is dead to me the way he has sucked up to Trump. There is no sincerity in Graham's words. I have been a life-long Republican until Trump. I am 80 yrs. old, and the Republicans are no long recognizable.
As a South African living in America this reminds me very scarily of the fall of the White Nationalists in South Africa when suddenly they were all pro the release of Nelson Mandela so that they could slip into the shadows. They then cane back and caused havoc through violence and murder to try and destabilize the change we as a country wanted, needed. These are evil people, evil to the core. They will stab us all in the back. I’m sorry to be so dark but I’ve been here and never believed I’d see it again, so real, so painful, so violent. When Trump did what he did for his photo op at the Church on Tuesday, using the Army it was confirmed clearly to me, a white person, that racism is by design in America, just like it was in South Africa. Apartheid is alive in America. The systematic control, oppression and manipulation of anyone that is non-white. The denial of rights and the inequity in the application of equality and law.
I am completely ambivalent about Republicans when they "say the right thing", because I think that is just politically correct verbiage designed to pacify the people. Actions speak louder than words, and the actions of the Republican Party have told us exactly where it stands on the issue of racial and social justice. In fact, I suspect strongly that Tom Cotton speaks for more than a few of them, and that the only difference between him and them is that he is willing to "say out loud" what the others are trying to hide in their hearts.
I am whiter than a fish's underbelly, traditionally liberal, and I don't trust either of those old white men any further than I could throw them. At 65, my physical strength isn't what it used to be, so that's, like, not at all. I have tried, throughout my life, despite my obvious white privilege, to be an ally. I give to worthy causes, I vote for those who claim they'll champion civil rights, and I follow up with my legislators with correspondence demanding their votes on civil rights issues. I try. I could do better, I'm sure, as could everyone who has benefited from centuries of white-ruled largesse. I'll never quit trying.
I tend to call the current GOP the Trump Party, rather than the Republican Party, as it’s goals are almost entirely different from the GOP of 20 years ago. I think George Bush just sounds like the Republican of a long gone era. His attitude hasn’t changed. Lindsay? He doesn’t have a right to speak to any of us right now.
We always need to remember that this was a strategy started by Reagan and Lee Atwater of feeding racist red meat to the base while thinking they could use it for votes and keep them leashed the rest of the time. They have now, which seems inevitable to anyone with any forethought, broken off their leash and the people that created them can't control them.
George Bush wants you to think he is the kinder, gentler face of the Republican party but the reality is it is the thoughts and beliefs of people like Tom Cotton and William Barr the run that party. And Graham really is a pilot fish with not an ounce of any morals he can call his own.
Graham has spewed so many contradictory statements that I don't believe anything he conjures up is genuine. Maybe there was once a good heart in there, but it's been obscured by so much vitriol and utter BS that I doubt even he knows who he is anymore.
GWB, though, I believed has learned a few things since he took office back in 2000.
a) Lindsey Graham has burned every gram of his credibility and moral authority as an apologist for Trump, and while any effort toward addressing systemic racism and inequality is a starting point, he's not the person to be leading anything. He should step back and promote the ideas and efforts of POC.
b) GWB prosecuted an immoral war on false pretenses. He's a pleasant monster. He does, however, believe in the possibility of redemption both personal and national, and he does have at least the empathic core that DJT so obviously lacks.
I'm a very left of center Dem Black woman who hasn't trusted anything Bush has said, nevermind Graham. My first reaction was incredulity that they'd bothered and deep skepticism.Then I thought about what it meant that Bush, (who probably isn't aware of any Black activists post MLK), spoke out at all. I suspect his motivation has much less to do with real concern for us but for capitalism. But that he saw a vacuum of leadership and tried to fill it, is telling. I honestly don't believe Bush is being sincere and am certain someone else wrote that statement for him but that he bothered at all says to me that the vacuum of leadership is persuading him, the Lincoln Project folk, and other Republicans to voice their objections, finally. I saw in the comments where people were asking him to endorse Biden. I doubt that will happen but that he's being asked is also telling. It's disturbing to me that we need to ask a republican to endorse a Democrat because we aren't confident in our pick? Or that the stakes are so high they transcend party lines? I think - hope, the latter. Graham is as always covering every side of his bets hoping to survive either way. He's a stereotypic spineless politician. In short, I believe Bush wants the riots to end and his money train to continue and if that ends up benefitting Black folk then fine. I don't believe Graham at all.
I'm with many of the other commenters. Lindsey Graham is a lost cause and the sooner he leaves, the better. "W" is more complicated - I never really liked him when he was in office, especially the scare tactics at the end of term 1 (remember the terrorist threat color levels that disappeared after he was reelected?), but since he left office he seems to have either developed or reclaimed his integrity. He has spoken out on other things as well, so I am having more hope that he, like Mitt Romney for example, can be a force for good here.
I don't know what to think, tbh. If old school (elected) Republicans (who are entirely responsible for letting POTUS get to this point) were to really rebel, it would be over for Trump and Barr. I have very little hope that they will tho.
It’s only words. I’d sing that if I could. Has either republican done anything to back up these words? George - SMH. Graham - he’s a snake and a trumper. Zero credibility in my opinion.
I tend to believe politicians more when they’re not running for re-election. That being said, Graham is a reprehensible human being and way too little, too late.
Lindsey Graham must be feeling the heat in his Senate race. Jaime Harrison is only a point or two away in some polls, and Graham knows that the Democratic base is super-energized against him. So anything he does seems calculated to help him survive November, which makes it more eyeroll-inducing than inspiring.
As for Smirky, who previously wore the mantle of "Worst. Ever," we'll take it. (Although we wish he had mentioned Trump by name.) It not only was the decent thing to do, it contributes to the discord in the Republican Party, which is what we want. And perhaps more significantly, between Bush's statement yesterday and Obama speaking today at 5 PM, I'm sensing a shift in the Former Presidents Club. They're traditionally loath to make waves because, as the saying goes, we only have one President at a time. Makes one wonder what's happening behind the scenes. Is Clinton next? Carter?
I’m not sure what prompted Bush to issue his statement but I would like to think he believes what he said. I don’t consider him a terrible person.
On the other hand I wouldn’t believe anything Lindsey Graham says. He has shown he has given up his integrity and this comment he made is just political.
It feels like nothing more than lip service, more so from Graham than Bush, but neither has a stellar history of supporting civil rights or the black community in general. I would like to think Bush has grown since his presidency, but there's hesitancy to buy in too much. I think we all know Graham has regressed, not grown. He's a liar, plain and simple.
Came to read/comment from Twitter. Actions speak louder than words is one of the oldest but most relevant expressions I can think of. Graham has shown himself to be nothing more than an enabler for the last 3 years, so I don't take anything he says seriously - and hope his constituents also see through his bullshit. I do believe President Bush is a more honorable speaker in terms of meaning what he says - but I will never forget what a horrid President he was. He's being lifted up now mainly because compared to Trump, he looks like a saint...but he's still a war criminal.
It's about party. Let's not forget that Bush essentially handed the Treasury to his friends by creating a diversionary war. Trump and his crew are taking the leavings which is apparently, the country itself.
I think they should have spoken out to support Hillary. I think there have been a lot of previous opportunities for them to denounce this administration's actions which go against democratic values and the rule of law. Where were they for the Muslim ban? The separation of families? The caging of families? The forced opening of meat-packing plants, the deregulation that is allowing corporations to pollute our air and water? Why didn't they speak up when William Barr lied about the conclusions of the Mueller report, which exposed attacks on the foundations of our democracy? Too little. Too late.
Graham is a piece of garbage. Bush may or not be a nice guy but he was a stupid corporate-aligned thinker who allowed himself to be led around by dangerously stupid cabinet members, to the detriment of the country. As far as I'm concerned, they can talk to the hand...
Graham's statements I don't buy into because his mind works like a pinball machine. I do believe George,Jr. is sincere. Though his presidency eventually became a bad painting (though since taking painting lessons, his paintings are quite good-literally), I think Bush appeared to be a president who felt everything was not about him.
If their comments serve to begin an awakening among conservatives, it'll be a good thing. With everything either done or ignored by the GOP however, it's beyond credulity that they have suddenly become enlightened. Better then become extinct.
Lots of clichés come to mind ... actions speak louder than words, put your money where your mouth is ... Graham is a racist trump toady And Bush is a war criminal. So 🤷🏻♀️
Some people, including you and me, are capable of learning and changing. That does not take away the damages they caused, but I think they can be trusted now (GW more than Linsey). Also: may be people who made mistakes can be trusted more in their later life, because they learned from it: HRC, Biden.
For a couple of years I tried to decide if Bush’s Iraq war made him worse than Trump bc of the deaths and severe injuries of so many American soldiers. But now, since Covid-19, Barr, Pompeo and the almost total deregulation of capitalism, I’m willing to give Bush kudos here.
I don't believe Graham. He flips more, on issues, than a fish out of water. Bush? I think he's sincere, but yet there's that doubt.
Chicago was/is diverse but it had/has it's ugliness. When I was growing up there, there was no racism or bigotry, in my house. My dad actually decked a guy for referring to a co-worker as "n". My family was sickened by what was happening to the Black community, during the Civil Rights movement. To this day I don't understand groups who hate another group of people because of where they're from, the color of their skin or how the worship. I guess, that makes me a flaming Liberal. Damn proud, too!
Lindsey Graham can go suck eggs. George W Bush I only give a little credit to because Michelle Obama seems to have an affection for him (although I can’t imagine why)
President Bush has always been sincere in his remarks, even when he was ill-advised by Cheney he was sincere. I trust his statement as a thoughtful, honest, personal commentary. Lindsey has his moments, but he has an opponent who is better positioned to move South Carolina forward. SC is often referenced as Trumpistan. Until he calls out POTUS for inciting violence, his declarations are suspect.
I do think that Bush is sincere. I’ve never agreed with Bush on almost every issue. But he was more willing to move on immigration than other republicans. Graham sees the handwriting on the wall. He can see it all crumble before his eyes. This could be the end of Trump because he can’t step back. Graham is worried about his own political carcass.
To frame my comments, the answer to one of your closing questions first - I am more traditionally liberal.
I hear what you're saying about who is making these comments, especially Graham, whose history on position has been serpentine at best. I view the Bush statement differently - firstly, because presidents historically don't offer opinion about the conditions faced by sitting presidents, and secondly, because he is a GOP president.
So, to another of your questions - I think it's better to learn eventually than never at all. (It's best to listen to others so you can learn early, however, that wasn't ever possible in this case.) Graham's statement, though, is 100% spin.
The statements do make me feel cautiously optimistic, that maybe finally the timid have finally found some rationalized cover to finally speak out, even if the position is adopted because they see it as necessary for political survival in the near future. It's very important to add that I see the current conversation about race relations as inseparable from a referendum on 45. That makes the rim of light on the optimism a bit brighter. Already, governors, mayors, and law enforcement leaders have spoken out about George Floyd in particular, as well as about the rhetoric coming from the White House. Those candid, authentic comments gave 2 very visible Republicans the cover to say something. In turn, their statements have been magnified by very strong words of rebuke from both the current and former Secretaries of Defense. Those events are major factors in getting more to tip toe out of the shadow to find the nearest microphone. That's going to be necessary for the next step toward shifting the path the country has been on and toward true change.
Graham has proved time and again that he will say whatever he needs to say in the moment to keep his head above water. He has an election to win and he will act like he cares right up until Nov 4. The only thing that will keep moving in any positive direction is if his perceived seat of power - DT - loses his re-election. Then Graham will seek to remind JB that he was his best friend. Honestly, he has proven himself to be what is so very bad in our politics. Survival over integrity is an ugly look. I do hope that South Carolina sees that. Bush disturbs me, but I can see a heart at least. We have Donald Trump to thank for that.
Trump always reminds me of Ed Norton's line from the Honeymooners (sorry, is my age showing?) where Ralph says "If you see me coming down the street, get on the other side" and Norton responds "When you come down the street, there ain't no other side." Trump has pushed so much of what was the Sensible Right into the opposition. People I would have written angry letters to the editor about are now holding spots on my bookshelf. I know and hope they once again have a home on the other side of the political fence, but for now we have a common goal - to defeat this clear threat to our democracy. Sorry, rabbit hole of thoughts.
Bush seems sincere and now that he is retired, he should be somewhat of an elder statesman who would want to bring the country together.
Graham is totally a political opportunist, probably thinks it's his party once Trump is out as long as he stays a Trump ally, but knows he has to win re-election which FiveThirtyEight has at 42-42.
I don't think Graham will ever change, even after he's out of office. He belongs in that first basket.
Seriously Amy? Lind’s has already shown his true character; he didn’t wait for McCain’s body to turn cold before he jumped on the trump train! He’s up for re-election and knows which way the wind is blowing, which obviously means he’s gonna be lying till ....
Had dinner with W a couple of times before his dad made him straighten up...he’s not a bad person, not insincere, just inept. However, Lindsey’s moral compass went into the grave with McCain.
Are you completely mad? Leningrad Lindseycunt is not only a whore of epic proportions who went from 'dRUMPf will destroy us' to dRUMPf's main cloacal fluffer in a matter of months, she is the most self-hating, evil, toxic old queen in all of DC (and that includes PutaBITCH Moscow Mitch.) and , of course, has kompromat out her every orifice because she's STILL in the closet.
As a moderate WOC, I think it's very Romneyesque of them, and am totally apathetic. It's like they're standing in front of a burning house whispering "fire."
I would like to believe that former president Bush was sincere, but not hanging hope on that peg. I don't believe a word from graham's mouth. He has strong opposition in November from a positive, strong, hopeful, young Black Democrat, who I pray will be victorious. graham is just trying to strengthen his reelection chances.
At least Dubya was never a Trump fan and, different than Bob Dole, for instance, he never made his peace with the Trump regime. So, I think his disgust with Trump is sincere. This is not his GOP. But he seems to be absolutely unaware how his own presidency laid the groundwork for the Trump presidency. His tax cuts, his budget cuts, his judges, his economic policy - it all hurt minorities. And then there was Katrina: a terrible display of neglect towards African Americans. I don't think that GWB is a racist, at least not overtly (even to himself). But he has to own his record before I would give him the benefit of the doubt.
I think President Bush is sincere, however Lindsey Graham is dead to me the way he has sucked up to Trump. There is no sincerity in Graham's words. I have been a life-long Republican until Trump. I am 80 yrs. old, and the Republicans are no long recognizable.
As a South African living in America this reminds me very scarily of the fall of the White Nationalists in South Africa when suddenly they were all pro the release of Nelson Mandela so that they could slip into the shadows. They then cane back and caused havoc through violence and murder to try and destabilize the change we as a country wanted, needed. These are evil people, evil to the core. They will stab us all in the back. I’m sorry to be so dark but I’ve been here and never believed I’d see it again, so real, so painful, so violent. When Trump did what he did for his photo op at the Church on Tuesday, using the Army it was confirmed clearly to me, a white person, that racism is by design in America, just like it was in South Africa. Apartheid is alive in America. The systematic control, oppression and manipulation of anyone that is non-white. The denial of rights and the inequity in the application of equality and law.
Graham is lost. W seems to be coming around, and that is commendable, but I think he should endorse Biden and help to bridge the divide.
I am completely ambivalent about Republicans when they "say the right thing", because I think that is just politically correct verbiage designed to pacify the people. Actions speak louder than words, and the actions of the Republican Party have told us exactly where it stands on the issue of racial and social justice. In fact, I suspect strongly that Tom Cotton speaks for more than a few of them, and that the only difference between him and them is that he is willing to "say out loud" what the others are trying to hide in their hearts.
I am whiter than a fish's underbelly, traditionally liberal, and I don't trust either of those old white men any further than I could throw them. At 65, my physical strength isn't what it used to be, so that's, like, not at all. I have tried, throughout my life, despite my obvious white privilege, to be an ally. I give to worthy causes, I vote for those who claim they'll champion civil rights, and I follow up with my legislators with correspondence demanding their votes on civil rights issues. I try. I could do better, I'm sure, as could everyone who has benefited from centuries of white-ruled largesse. I'll never quit trying.
I tend to call the current GOP the Trump Party, rather than the Republican Party, as it’s goals are almost entirely different from the GOP of 20 years ago. I think George Bush just sounds like the Republican of a long gone era. His attitude hasn’t changed. Lindsay? He doesn’t have a right to speak to any of us right now.
Too little, too late.
We always need to remember that this was a strategy started by Reagan and Lee Atwater of feeding racist red meat to the base while thinking they could use it for votes and keep them leashed the rest of the time. They have now, which seems inevitable to anyone with any forethought, broken off their leash and the people that created them can't control them.
George Bush wants you to think he is the kinder, gentler face of the Republican party but the reality is it is the thoughts and beliefs of people like Tom Cotton and William Barr the run that party. And Graham really is a pilot fish with not an ounce of any morals he can call his own.
Graham has spewed so many contradictory statements that I don't believe anything he conjures up is genuine. Maybe there was once a good heart in there, but it's been obscured by so much vitriol and utter BS that I doubt even he knows who he is anymore.
GWB, though, I believed has learned a few things since he took office back in 2000.
a) Lindsey Graham has burned every gram of his credibility and moral authority as an apologist for Trump, and while any effort toward addressing systemic racism and inequality is a starting point, he's not the person to be leading anything. He should step back and promote the ideas and efforts of POC.
b) GWB prosecuted an immoral war on false pretenses. He's a pleasant monster. He does, however, believe in the possibility of redemption both personal and national, and he does have at least the empathic core that DJT so obviously lacks.
I see it as typical lip service from a bunch of do nothing Republicans
don't buy their bs for a second. the only thing they've learned is how to lie better
I'm a very left of center Dem Black woman who hasn't trusted anything Bush has said, nevermind Graham. My first reaction was incredulity that they'd bothered and deep skepticism.Then I thought about what it meant that Bush, (who probably isn't aware of any Black activists post MLK), spoke out at all. I suspect his motivation has much less to do with real concern for us but for capitalism. But that he saw a vacuum of leadership and tried to fill it, is telling. I honestly don't believe Bush is being sincere and am certain someone else wrote that statement for him but that he bothered at all says to me that the vacuum of leadership is persuading him, the Lincoln Project folk, and other Republicans to voice their objections, finally. I saw in the comments where people were asking him to endorse Biden. I doubt that will happen but that he's being asked is also telling. It's disturbing to me that we need to ask a republican to endorse a Democrat because we aren't confident in our pick? Or that the stakes are so high they transcend party lines? I think - hope, the latter. Graham is as always covering every side of his bets hoping to survive either way. He's a stereotypic spineless politician. In short, I believe Bush wants the riots to end and his money train to continue and if that ends up benefitting Black folk then fine. I don't believe Graham at all.
I'm with many of the other commenters. Lindsey Graham is a lost cause and the sooner he leaves, the better. "W" is more complicated - I never really liked him when he was in office, especially the scare tactics at the end of term 1 (remember the terrorist threat color levels that disappeared after he was reelected?), but since he left office he seems to have either developed or reclaimed his integrity. He has spoken out on other things as well, so I am having more hope that he, like Mitt Romney for example, can be a force for good here.
I don't know what to think, tbh. If old school (elected) Republicans (who are entirely responsible for letting POTUS get to this point) were to really rebel, it would be over for Trump and Barr. I have very little hope that they will tho.
I do believe Bush but no way do I believe Graham. However, it is an election year, right?
It’s only words. I’d sing that if I could. Has either republican done anything to back up these words? George - SMH. Graham - he’s a snake and a trumper. Zero credibility in my opinion.
I tend to believe politicians more when they’re not running for re-election. That being said, Graham is a reprehensible human being and way too little, too late.
Lindsey Graham must be feeling the heat in his Senate race. Jaime Harrison is only a point or two away in some polls, and Graham knows that the Democratic base is super-energized against him. So anything he does seems calculated to help him survive November, which makes it more eyeroll-inducing than inspiring.
As for Smirky, who previously wore the mantle of "Worst. Ever," we'll take it. (Although we wish he had mentioned Trump by name.) It not only was the decent thing to do, it contributes to the discord in the Republican Party, which is what we want. And perhaps more significantly, between Bush's statement yesterday and Obama speaking today at 5 PM, I'm sensing a shift in the Former Presidents Club. They're traditionally loath to make waves because, as the saying goes, we only have one President at a time. Makes one wonder what's happening behind the scenes. Is Clinton next? Carter?
I’m not sure what prompted Bush to issue his statement but I would like to think he believes what he said. I don’t consider him a terrible person.
On the other hand I wouldn’t believe anything Lindsey Graham says. He has shown he has given up his integrity and this comment he made is just political.
Just my opinion.
It feels like nothing more than lip service, more so from Graham than Bush, but neither has a stellar history of supporting civil rights or the black community in general. I would like to think Bush has grown since his presidency, but there's hesitancy to buy in too much. I think we all know Graham has regressed, not grown. He's a liar, plain and simple.
Came to read/comment from Twitter. Actions speak louder than words is one of the oldest but most relevant expressions I can think of. Graham has shown himself to be nothing more than an enabler for the last 3 years, so I don't take anything he says seriously - and hope his constituents also see through his bullshit. I do believe President Bush is a more honorable speaker in terms of meaning what he says - but I will never forget what a horrid President he was. He's being lifted up now mainly because compared to Trump, he looks like a saint...but he's still a war criminal.
It's about party. Let's not forget that Bush essentially handed the Treasury to his friends by creating a diversionary war. Trump and his crew are taking the leavings which is apparently, the country itself.
I just don’t trust either of them. I only hope W endorses Biden. That’s probably a bridge too far for him tho.
I think they should have spoken out to support Hillary. I think there have been a lot of previous opportunities for them to denounce this administration's actions which go against democratic values and the rule of law. Where were they for the Muslim ban? The separation of families? The caging of families? The forced opening of meat-packing plants, the deregulation that is allowing corporations to pollute our air and water? Why didn't they speak up when William Barr lied about the conclusions of the Mueller report, which exposed attacks on the foundations of our democracy? Too little. Too late.
After this post, Mattis spoke out in The Atlantic. It's a good sign, but I hope it's not too late.
Graham is a piece of garbage. Bush may or not be a nice guy but he was a stupid corporate-aligned thinker who allowed himself to be led around by dangerously stupid cabinet members, to the detriment of the country. As far as I'm concerned, they can talk to the hand...
Graham's statements I don't buy into because his mind works like a pinball machine. I do believe George,Jr. is sincere. Though his presidency eventually became a bad painting (though since taking painting lessons, his paintings are quite good-literally), I think Bush appeared to be a president who felt everything was not about him.
Neither of these men have any credibility as far as I’m concerned.
If their comments serve to begin an awakening among conservatives, it'll be a good thing. With everything either done or ignored by the GOP however, it's beyond credulity that they have suddenly become enlightened. Better then become extinct.
Lots of clichés come to mind ... actions speak louder than words, put your money where your mouth is ... Graham is a racist trump toady And Bush is a war criminal. So 🤷🏻♀️
Nothing but Words Without Action.
The same BS we have heard from politicians for decades upon decades.
They talk a good game ... And when the dust settles they are silent again and nowhere to be found.
Some people, including you and me, are capable of learning and changing. That does not take away the damages they caused, but I think they can be trusted now (GW more than Linsey). Also: may be people who made mistakes can be trusted more in their later life, because they learned from it: HRC, Biden.
For a couple of years I tried to decide if Bush’s Iraq war made him worse than Trump bc of the deaths and severe injuries of so many American soldiers. But now, since Covid-19, Barr, Pompeo and the almost total deregulation of capitalism, I’m willing to give Bush kudos here.
I don't believe Graham. He flips more, on issues, than a fish out of water. Bush? I think he's sincere, but yet there's that doubt.
Chicago was/is diverse but it had/has it's ugliness. When I was growing up there, there was no racism or bigotry, in my house. My dad actually decked a guy for referring to a co-worker as "n". My family was sickened by what was happening to the Black community, during the Civil Rights movement. To this day I don't understand groups who hate another group of people because of where they're from, the color of their skin or how the worship. I guess, that makes me a flaming Liberal. Damn proud, too!
my own internal jury is out deliberating on these two right now
Lindsey Graham can go suck eggs. George W Bush I only give a little credit to because Michelle Obama seems to have an affection for him (although I can’t imagine why)
I AM APPALLED. THEY ARE ONLY DOING THIS TO TRY TO RETURN TO THE OLD NORMAL OF WHITE SUPREMACY.
President Bush has always been sincere in his remarks, even when he was ill-advised by Cheney he was sincere. I trust his statement as a thoughtful, honest, personal commentary. Lindsey has his moments, but he has an opponent who is better positioned to move South Carolina forward. SC is often referenced as Trumpistan. Until he calls out POTUS for inciting violence, his declarations are suspect.
insulted, more than anything.
Makes no real difference to me, might to people I don't know, maybe.
Other hand? It's *slightly* better than nothing
I do think that Bush is sincere. I’ve never agreed with Bush on almost every issue. But he was more willing to move on immigration than other republicans. Graham sees the handwriting on the wall. He can see it all crumble before his eyes. This could be the end of Trump because he can’t step back. Graham is worried about his own political carcass.
To frame my comments, the answer to one of your closing questions first - I am more traditionally liberal.
I hear what you're saying about who is making these comments, especially Graham, whose history on position has been serpentine at best. I view the Bush statement differently - firstly, because presidents historically don't offer opinion about the conditions faced by sitting presidents, and secondly, because he is a GOP president.
So, to another of your questions - I think it's better to learn eventually than never at all. (It's best to listen to others so you can learn early, however, that wasn't ever possible in this case.) Graham's statement, though, is 100% spin.
The statements do make me feel cautiously optimistic, that maybe finally the timid have finally found some rationalized cover to finally speak out, even if the position is adopted because they see it as necessary for political survival in the near future. It's very important to add that I see the current conversation about race relations as inseparable from a referendum on 45. That makes the rim of light on the optimism a bit brighter. Already, governors, mayors, and law enforcement leaders have spoken out about George Floyd in particular, as well as about the rhetoric coming from the White House. Those candid, authentic comments gave 2 very visible Republicans the cover to say something. In turn, their statements have been magnified by very strong words of rebuke from both the current and former Secretaries of Defense. Those events are major factors in getting more to tip toe out of the shadow to find the nearest microphone. That's going to be necessary for the next step toward shifting the path the country has been on and toward true change.
Graham has proved time and again that he will say whatever he needs to say in the moment to keep his head above water. He has an election to win and he will act like he cares right up until Nov 4. The only thing that will keep moving in any positive direction is if his perceived seat of power - DT - loses his re-election. Then Graham will seek to remind JB that he was his best friend. Honestly, he has proven himself to be what is so very bad in our politics. Survival over integrity is an ugly look. I do hope that South Carolina sees that. Bush disturbs me, but I can see a heart at least. We have Donald Trump to thank for that.
Trump always reminds me of Ed Norton's line from the Honeymooners (sorry, is my age showing?) where Ralph says "If you see me coming down the street, get on the other side" and Norton responds "When you come down the street, there ain't no other side." Trump has pushed so much of what was the Sensible Right into the opposition. People I would have written angry letters to the editor about are now holding spots on my bookshelf. I know and hope they once again have a home on the other side of the political fence, but for now we have a common goal - to defeat this clear threat to our democracy. Sorry, rabbit hole of thoughts.
Bush seems sincere and now that he is retired, he should be somewhat of an elder statesman who would want to bring the country together.
Graham is totally a political opportunist, probably thinks it's his party once Trump is out as long as he stays a Trump ally, but knows he has to win re-election which FiveThirtyEight has at 42-42.
I don't think Graham will ever change, even after he's out of office. He belongs in that first basket.
Seriously Amy? Lind’s has already shown his true character; he didn’t wait for McCain’s body to turn cold before he jumped on the trump train! He’s up for re-election and knows which way the wind is blowing, which obviously means he’s gonna be lying till ....
Had dinner with W a couple of times before his dad made him straighten up...he’s not a bad person, not insincere, just inept. However, Lindsey’s moral compass went into the grave with McCain.
Are you completely mad? Leningrad Lindseycunt is not only a whore of epic proportions who went from 'dRUMPf will destroy us' to dRUMPf's main cloacal fluffer in a matter of months, she is the most self-hating, evil, toxic old queen in all of DC (and that includes PutaBITCH Moscow Mitch.) and , of course, has kompromat out her every orifice because she's STILL in the closet.